Ryan Grim: ‘I Hope that This Is the Last Democratic Nominee Who Says No to Joe Rogan’

EXCERPT:

HASAN: "My worry is that what does it say for us as a country, that we can identify all these problems, but Donald Trump is the solution?"
GRIM: "He’s not. He is not."
HASAN: "People say to me inflation is what drove a lot of this, right?"
GRIM: "Yeah."
HASAN: "OK. But you've just elected a man who's going to drive up prices with tariffs."
CALLOWAY: “But it's not about policy.
HASAN: "I know. That's the problem."
CALLOWAY: “There is no policy space. There is no --"
HASAN: "I agree with you.
CALLOWAY: “-- there is no substantive solution that he presented that justified him as the savior for any of these very serious challenges that you've identified. And that's why you can't -- we cannot diminish two things. First of all, he ran against a black woman. Even though he offered nothing, he ran against a black woman and there's racism and sexism baked into it."
HASAN: "Yeah."
CALLOWAY: “Especially dangerous when you merge that with the private ownership of information vehicles. We have never faced this in our country. And it is completely wide open for some smart progressive to figure out how we're going to overcome that. But I have to imagine that the successful campaigns of the next 10 years will have to look dramatically different than democratic infrastructure has looked like in the profession that raised Ryan and I."
GRIM: "And -- and I can say, and maybe you had this experience too, as somebody who's in the independent media, our show on 'Breaking Points' last night --"
HASAN: "Yeah."
GRIM: "-- consistently had close to 100,000 people watching, millions of viewers, no attention from Democrats, lots of attention from Republicans. I hope that this is the last Democratic nominee who says no to Joe Rogan. Like, even if you have to go to the studio."
HASAN: "I would go further than that, Ryan."
GRIM: "Yeah."
HASAN: "You need your own Joe Rogan is the bigger point. That's the bigger problem. Not to go on Joe Rogan."
GRIM: "Well, Democrats -- Democrats had their own Joe Rogan. Joe Rogan endorsed Bernie Sanders in 2020." (Laughter)
HASAN: "Well, look where he ended up."