German Prosecutors Defend ‘Online Hate Speech’ Raids: Free Speech ‘Has Its Limits,’ You Can’t Insult People

ALFONSI voice over If ░░░░░░░░ ve ever dared to ░░░░░░░░ the comments on a ░░░░░░░░ media post you might ░░░░░░░░ to wonder if civilized ░░░░░░░░ is just a myth ░░░░░░░░ threats lies and harassment ░░░░░░░░ unfortunately become the norm ░░░░░░░░ where anonymity has emboldened ░░░░░░░░ users to push the ░░░░░░░░ of civility In the ░░░░░░░░ States most of what ░░░░░░░░ says sends or streams ░░░░░░░░ even if it s ░░░░░░░░ filled or toxic is ░░░░░░░░ by the First Amendment ░░░░░░░░ free speech But Germany ░░░░░░░░ trying to bring some ░░░░░░░░ to the world wide ░░░░░░░░ by policing it in ░░░░░░░░ way most Americans could ░░░░░░░░ imagine In an effort ░░░░░░░░ says to protect discourse ░░░░░░░░ authorities have started prosecuting ░░░░░░░░ trolls And as we ░░░░░░░░ it often begins with ░░░░░░░░ pre dawn wake up ░░░░░░░░ from the police ALFONSI ░░░░░░░░ over It s 6 ░░░░░░░░ on a Tuesday morning ░░░░░░░░ we were with state ░░░░░░░░ as they raided this ░░░░░░░░ in northwest Germany Inside ░░░░░░░░ armed officers searched a ░░░░░░░░ s home then seized ░░░░░░░░ laptop and cellphone Prosecutors ░░░░░░░░ those electronics may have ░░░░░░░░ used to commit a ░░░░░░░░ The crime Posting a ░░░░░░░░ cartoon online At the ░░░░░░░░ same time across Germany ░░░░░░░░ than 50 similar raids ░░░░░░░░ out Part of what ░░░░░░░░ say is a coordinated ░░░░░░░░ to curb online hate ░░░░░░░░ in Germany ALFONSI on ░░░░░░░░ What s the typical ░░░░░░░░ when the police show ░░░░░░░░ at somebody s door ░░░░░░░░ they say Hey we ░░░░░░░░ you wrote this on ░░░░░░░░ Internet FINK They say ░░░░░░░░ Germany we say Das ░░░░░░░░ man ja wohl noch ░░░░░░░░ d rfen So we ░░░░░░░░ here with crimes of ░░░░░░░░ posting on internet and ░░░░░░░░ people are surprised that ░░░░░░░░ is really illegal to ░░░░░░░░ these kind of words ░░░░░░░░ They don t think ░░░░░░░░ was illegal FINK No ░░░░░░░░ don t think it ░░░░░░░░ illegal And they say ░░░░░░░░ that s my free ░░░░░░░░ And we say No ░░░░░░░░ have free speech as ░░░░░░░░ but it is also ░░░░░░░░ its limits ALFONSI voice ░░░░░░░░ Interpreting those limits is ░░░░░░░░ of the job for ░░░░░░░░ Matth us Fink Svenja ░░░░░░░░ and Frank Michael Laue ░░░░░░░░ few of the state ░░░░░░░░ tasked with policing Germany ░░░░░░░░ robust hate speech laws ░░░░░░░░ After its darkest chapter ░░░░░░░░ strengthened its speech laws ░░░░░░░░ prosecutors explain it the ░░░░░░░░ constitution protects free speech ░░░░░░░░ not hate speech And ░░░░░░░░ s where it gets ░░░░░░░░ German law prohibits any ░░░░░░░░ that could incite hatred ░░░░░░░░ is deemed insulting ALFONSI ░░░░░░░░ camera It s illegal ░░░░░░░░ display Nazi symbolism a ░░░░░░░░ or deny the Holocaust ░░░░░░░░ s clear Is it ░░░░░░░░ crime to insult somebody ░░░░░░░░ public MEININGHAUS Yes LAUE ░░░░░░░░ it is ALFONSI And ░░░░░░░░ s a crime to ░░░░░░░░ them online as well ░░░░░░░░ Yes FINK The fine ░░░░░░░░ be even higher if ░░░░░░░░ insult someone in the ░░░░░░░░ ALFONSI Why FINK Because ░░░░░░░░ internet it stays there ░░░░░░░░ we are talking face ░░░░░░░░ face you insult me ░░░░░░░░ insult you okay Finish ░░░░░░░░ if you re in ░░░░░░░░ internet if I insult ░░░░░░░░ or a politician ALFONSI ░░░░░░░░ sticks around forever FINK ░░░░░░░░ ALFONSI voice over The ░░░░░░░░ explained German law also ░░░░░░░░ the spread of malicious ░░░░░░░░ violent threats and fake ░░░░░░░░ ALFONSI on camera If ░░░░░░░░ posts something that s ░░░░░░░░ true and then somebody ░░░░░░░░ reposts it or likes ░░░░░░░░ are they committing a ░░░░░░░░ MEININGHAUS Yeah in the ░░░░░░░░ of reposting it is ░░░░░░░░ crime as well because ░░░░░░░░ reader can t distinguish ░░░░░░░░ you just invented this ░░░░░░░░ just reposted it It ░░░░░░░░ the same for us ░░░░░░░░ voice over The punishment ░░░░░░░░ breaking hate speech laws ░░░░░░░░ include jail time for ░░░░░░░░ offenders But in most ░░░░░░░░ a judge levies a ░░░░░░░░ fine and sometimes keeps ░░░░░░░░ devices ALFONSI on camera ░░░░░░░░ do people react when ░░░░░░░░ take their phones from ░░░░░░░░ LAUE They are shocked ░░░░░░░░ s a kind of ░░░░░░░░ if you lose your ░░░░░░░░ It s even worse ░░░░░░░░ the fine you have ░░░░░░░░ pay ALFONSI on camera ░░░░░░░░ your whole life is ░░░░░░░░ on your phone now ░░░░░░░░ voice over The application ░░░░░░░░ Germany s decades old ░░░░░░░░ laws to the online ░░░░░░░░ was accelerated after an ░░░░░░░░ fueled by the internet ░░░░░░░░ shockwaves through the country ░░░░░░░░ 2015 a video of ░░░░░░░░ local politician named Walter ░░░░░░░░ bcke went viral after ░░░░░░░░ defended then Chancellor Angela ░░░░░░░░ s progressive immigration policy ░░░░░░░░ People with a very ░░░░░░░░ political world view they ░░░░░░░░ hating him on the ░░░░░░░░ They started insulting him ░░░░░░░░ started to incite people ░░░░░░░░ to kill him And ░░░░░░░░ went on for about ░░░░░░░░ years ALFONSI on camera ░░░░░░░░ MEININGHAUS Yes Until in ░░░░░░░░ so four years after ░░░░░░░░ gave that speech he ░░░░░░░░ shot in his head ░░░░░░░░ instantly dead So that ░░░░░░░░ one of the cases ░░░░░░░░ we see that online ░░░░░░░░ can sometimes find a ░░░░░░░░ into real life and ░░░░░░░░ hurt people ALFONSI voice ░░░░░░░░ After a man with ░░░░░░░░ to neo Nazis was ░░░░░░░░ Germany ramped up the ░░░░░░░░ of its online hate ░░░░░░░░ forces There are 16 ░░░░░░░░ across the country each ░░░░░░░░ a team of investigators ░░░░░░░░ Michael Laue a career ░░░░░░░░ prosecutor leads the Lower ░░░░░░░░ unit ALFONSI on camera ░░░░░░░░ many cases are you ░░░░░░░░ on at any time ░░░░░░░░ In our unit we ░░░░░░░░ about 3 500 cases ░░░░░░░░ year ALFONSI voice over ░░░░░░░░ investigators work out of ░░░░░░░░ office in a converted ░░░░░░░░ Laue says they get ░░░░░░░░ of tips a month ░░░░░░░░ police watchdog groups and ░░░░░░░░ The worst of the ░░░░░░░░ is wrapped in red ░░░░░░░░ folders stuffed with printouts ░░░░░░░░ online slurs threats and ░░░░░░░░ LAUE This is a ░░░░░░░░ offense so ALFONSI on ░░░░░░░░ What does that say ░░░░░░░░ German language reading the ░░░░░░░░ text Kletterpark f r ░░░░░░░░ chtlinge ALFONSI on camera ░░░░░░░░ they re suggesting that ░░░░░░░░ refugee children play in ░░░░░░░░ electrical wires Okay LAUE ░░░░░░░░ case the accused had ░░░░░░░░ pay 3 750 euros ░░░░░░░░ on camera Wow LAUE ░░░░░░░░ s not a parking ░░░░░░░░ ALFONSI on camera Not ░░░░░░░░ parking ticket ALFONSI voice ░░░░░░░░ To build their cases ░░░░░░░░ scour social media and ░░░░░░░░ public and government data ░░░░░░░░ says sometimes social media ░░░░░░░░ will provide information to ░░░░░░░░ but not always So ░░░░░░░░ task force employs special ░░░░░░░░ investigators to help unmask ░░░░░░░░ users ALFONSI on camera ░░░░░░░░ this is suggesting you ░░░░░░░░ people seeking asylum here ░░░░░░░░ voice over Laue says ░░░░░░░░ unit has successfully prosecuted ░░░░░░░░ 750 hate speech cases ░░░░░░░░ the last four years ░░░░░░░░ it was a 2021 ░░░░░░░░ involving a local politician ░░░░░░░░ Andy Grote that captured ░░░░░░░░ country s attention Grote ░░░░░░░░ about a tweet that ░░░░░░░░ him a pimmel a ░░░░░░░░ word for the male ░░░░░░░░ That triggered a police ░░░░░░░░ and accusations of excessive ░░░░░░░░ by the government As ░░░░░░░░ explained to us in ░░░░░░░░ it s OK to ░░░░░░░░ politics online But it ░░░░░░░░ be a crime to ░░░░░░░░ anyone a pimmel even ░░░░░░░░ politician ALFONSI on camera ░░░░░░░░ it sounds like you ░░░░░░░░ saying It s okay ░░░░░░░░ criticize a politician s ░░░░░░░░ but not to say ░░░░░░░░ think you re a ░░░░░░░░ and an idiot FINK ░░░░░░░░ Comments like You re ░░░░░░░░ of a bitch Excuse ░░░░░░░░ for using but these ░░░░░░░░ has nothing to do ░░░░░░░░ a political discussions or ░░░░░░░░ contribution to a discussion ░░░░░░░░ voice over Civility is ░░░░░░░░ than a commandment for ░░░░░░░░ rules are gospel Even ░░░░░░░░ a quiet street the ░░░░░░░░ signal is adhered to ░░░░░░░░ the devotion of a ░░░░░░░░ But some here worry ░░░░░░░░ policing the internet Germany ░░░░░░░░ backsliding ALFONSI on camera ░░░░░░░░ criticism is that you ░░░░░░░░ this feels like the ░░░░░░░░ that Germany conducted 80 ░░░░░░░░ ago How do you ░░░░░░░░ to that BALLON There ░░░░░░░░ no surveillance ALFONSI voice ░░░░░░░░ Josephine Ballon is a ░░░░░░░░ of HateAid a Berlin ░░░░░░░░ human rights organization that ░░░░░░░░ victims of online violence ░░░░░░░░ on camera In the ░░░░░░░░ States a lot of ░░░░░░░░ look at this and ░░░░░░░░ This is restricting free ░░░░░░░░ It s a threat ░░░░░░░░ democracy BALLON Free speech ░░░░░░░░ boundaries And in the ░░░░░░░░ of Germany these boundaries ░░░░░░░░ part of our constitution ░░░░░░░░ boundaries a very small ░░░░░░░░ of people can rely ░░░░░░░░ endless freedom to say ░░░░░░░░ that they want while ░░░░░░░░ else is scared and ░░░░░░░░ ALFONSI on camera And ░░░░░░░░ fear is that if ░░░░░░░░ are freely attacked online ░░░░░░░░ they ll withdraw from ░░░░░░░░ discussion BALLON This is ░░░░░░░░ only a fear It ░░░░░░░░ already taking place already ░░░░░░░░ of the internet users ░░░░░░░░ Germany are afraid to ░░░░░░░░ their political opinion and ░░░░░░░░ rarely participate in public ░░░░░░░░ online anymore Half of ░░░░░░░░ internet users ALFONSI voice ░░░░░░░░ Renate K nast is ░░░░░░░░ prominent German politician In ░░░░░░░░ this meme of the ░░░░░░░░ Party member appeared on ░░░░░░░░ falsely implying that she ░░░░░░░░ every German should learn ░░░░░░░░ ALFONSI on camera You ░░░░░░░░ said that K NAST ░░░░░░░░ never said that And ░░░░░░░░ harms my reputation Because ░░░░░░░░ say I think she ░░░░░░░░ a bit crazy Gosh ░░░░░░░░ can she say that ░░░░░░░░ voice over K nast ░░░░░░░░ 40 year politician says ░░░░░░░░ began receiving threats and ░░░░░░░░ filled comments from anonymous ░░░░░░░░ online ALFONSI on camera ░░░░░░░░ ve spent your a ░░░░░░░░ in politics What was ░░░░░░░░ about what took place ░░░░░░░░ K NAST The first ░░░░░░░░ was it was much ░░░░░░░░ personal You re looking ░░░░░░░░ ugly You are an ░░░░░░░░ woman You we know ░░░░░░░░ you live Or even ░░░░░░░░ should be raped by ░░░░░░░░ group of men so ░░░░░░░░ you see what all ░░░░░░░░ immigrants are doing ALFONSI ░░░░░░░░ camera So this was ░░░░░░░░ elevated conversation This was ░░░░░░░░ personal and very hateful ░░░░░░░░ NAST It was very ░░░░░░░░ ALFONSI voice over K ░░░░░░░░ asked Meta to delete ░░░░░░░░ the false quotes attributed ░░░░░░░░ her worldwide K NAST ░░░░░░░░ they were astonished What ░░░░░░░░ cannot do it they ░░░░░░░░ Just by software the ░░░░░░░░ is not able to ░░░░░░░░ with all this And ░░░░░░░░ have to get a ░░░░░░░░ of new employees And ░░░░░░░░ I said yes it ░░░░░░░░ my personal right It ░░░░░░░░ my reputation ALFONSI voice ░░░░░░░░ K nast sued Facebook ░░░░░░░░ won Last year in ░░░░░░░░ landmark case a German ░░░░░░░░ ruled Meta had to ░░░░░░░░ all the fake quotes ░░░░░░░░ to her Meta is ░░░░░░░░ K NAST This court ░░░░░░░░ in case of public ░░░░░░░░ which have public offices ░░░░░░░░ jobs it s public ░░░░░░░░ that their personal rights ░░░░░░░░ protected Because otherwise no ░░░░░░░░ would go for these ░░░░░░░░ you know That would ░░░░░░░░ democracy ALFONSI on camera ░░░░░░░░ all this are you ░░░░░░░░ less hateful comments now ░░░░░░░░ your social media feeds ░░░░░░░░ NAST Yes there are ░░░░░░░░ hateful comments And there ░░░░░░░░ one tweet which says ░░░░░░░░ t say that to ░░░░░░░░ she would take you ░░░░░░░░ court ALFONSI on camera ░░░░░░░░ might sue them K ░░░░░░░░ I might sue them ░░░░░░░░ voice over Last year ░░░░░░░░ European Union implemented a ░░░░░░░░ law that requires social ░░░░░░░░ companies to stop the ░░░░░░░░ of harmful content online ░░░░░░░░ Europe or face millions ░░░░░░░░ dollars in fines But ░░░░░░░░ Ballon of HateAid says ░░░░░░░░ social media companies are ░░░░░░░░ not complying with the ░░░░░░░░ law BALLON I would ░░░░░░░░ social media companies to ░░░░░░░░ a safer place than ░░░░░░░░ are right now But ░░░░░░░░ we see is that ░░░░░░░░ content moderation is not ░░░░░░░░ Sometimes it seems to ░░░░░░░░ working well in some ░░░░░░░░ but in many areas ░░░░░░░░ s just not ALFONSI ░░░░░░░░ over The European Commission ░░░░░░░░ currently investigating whether Elon ░░░░░░░░ s social media company ░░░░░░░░ has breached the EU ░░░░░░░░ content law Musk who ░░░░░░░░ been criticized for using ░░░░░░░░ to promote Germany s ░░░░░░░░ right party ahead of ░░░░░░░░ week s elections accused ░░░░░░░░ EU of censorship and ░░░░░░░░ democracy But in Lower ░░░░░░░░ prosecutors argue they are ░░░░░░░░ democracy and discourse by ░░░░░░░░ a touch of German ░░░░░░░░ to the unruly world ░░░░░░░░ web ALFONSI on camera ░░░░░░░░ re doing all this ░░░░░░░░ You re launching all ░░░░░░░░ investigations You re fining ░░░░░░░░ sometimes putting them in ░░░░░░░░ Does it make a ░░░░░░░░ if it s a ░░░░░░░░ web and there s ░░░░░░░░ lotta hate out there ░░░░░░░░ I would say yes ░░░░░░░░ what s the option ░░░░░░░░ option is to say ░░░░░░░░ don t do anything ░░░░░░░░ We are prosecutors If ░░░░░░░░ see a crime we ░░░░░░░░ to investigate it It ░░░░░░░░ a lot of work ░░░░░░░░ there are also borders ░░░░░░░░ s not an area ░░░░░░░░ law.”