RUSH TRANSCRIPT This is ░░░░░░░░ tonight we re going ░░░░░░░░ look back to a ░░░░░░░░ debate We haven t ░░░░░░░░ about in a while ░░░░░░░░ was worse Covid or ░░░░░░░░ lockdowns Now the reason ░░░░░░░░ we re talking about ░░░░░░░░ again is because Donald ░░░░░░░░ s pick to lead ░░░░░░░░ National Institutes of Health ░░░░░░░░ fine with the idea ░░░░░░░░ herd immunity which you ░░░░░░░░ or may not have ░░░░░░░░ was the idea of ░░░░░░░░ a virus run unchecked ░░░░░░░░ enough people have immunity ░░░░░░░░ that when someone gets ░░░░░░░░ the virus basically has ░░░░░░░░ to go Now sorry ░░░░░░░░ our fifth seed today ░░░░░░░░ doctor Devi Nampiaparampil thank ░░░░░░░░ for joining our table ░░░░░░░░ about that I want ░░░░░░░░ talk to you about ░░░░░░░░ bhattacharya who is Trump ░░░░░░░░ pick to lead the ░░░░░░░░ What s notable about ░░░░░░░░ his position was during ░░░░░░░░ height of kind of ░░░░░░░░ lockdowns specifically Yeah So ░░░░░░░░ argument was that the ░░░░░░░░ were too severe And ░░░░░░░░ of that was because ░░░░░░░░ was looking at for ░░░░░░░░ people with heart disease ░░░░░░░░ with cancer that would ░░░░░░░░ be able to get ░░░░░░░░ treatment that they needed ░░░░░░░░ the face of the ░░░░░░░░ So it was really ░░░░░░░░ question of you know ░░░░░░░░ is going to cause ░░░░░░░░ harm in the long ░░░░░░░░ And it wasn t ░░░░░░░░ all or nothing approach ░░░░░░░░ let s get rid ░░░░░░░░ the lockdowns It was ░░░░░░░░ that maybe we should ░░░░░░░░ some of these restrictions ░░░░░░░░ certain people Like he ░░░░░░░░ pointed out for kids ░░░░░░░░ example that their vaccination ░░░░░░░░ were going down because ░░░░░░░░ couldn t get to ░░░░░░░░ pediatrician So you know ░░░░░░░░ all these factors he ░░░░░░░░ asked some tough questions ░░░░░░░░ I think that provoked ░░░░░░░░ lot of controversy at ░░░░░░░░ time I think there ░░░░░░░░ so many figures out ░░░░░░░░ Covid who were and ░░░░░░░░ m just going to ░░░░░░░░ this word radicalized so ░░░░░░░░ speak from the experience ░░░░░░░░ just from my own ░░░░░░░░ like parents who came ░░░░░░░░ of the lockdowns just ░░░░░░░░ completely upset at their ░░░░░░░░ boards or one one ░░░░░░░░ or another tons and ░░░░░░░░ of voters who might ░░░░░░░░ have been in the ░░░░░░░░ of anti vax crowd ░░░░░░░░ had so many questions ░░░░░░░░ the vaccine that they ░░░░░░░░ it as a government ░░░░░░░░ Um can you talk ░░░░░░░░ me about like how ░░░░░░░░ see it having overhang ░░░░░░░░ a way that I ░░░░░░░░ Democrats have been suffering ░░░░░░░░ Well as somebody who ░░░░░░░░ spent quite a bit ░░░░░░░░ my career working in ░░░░░░░░ policy I think that ░░░░░░░░ of the most overt ░░░░░░░░ was what we saw ░░░░░░░░ it came to students ░░░░░░░░ to school We look ░░░░░░░░ the lapses in education ░░░░░░░░ it came to reading ░░░░░░░░ and math We look ░░░░░░░░ the fact that you ░░░░░░░░ the socialization of those ░░░░░░░░ people was extremely difficult ░░░░░░░░ higher rates of depression ░░░░░░░░ and other things from ░░░░░░░░ know being in isolation ░░░░░░░░ for quite some time ░░░░░░░░ I think that you ░░░░░░░░ in retrospect the idea ░░░░░░░░ that possibly those students ░░░░░░░░ have gone back to ░░░░░░░░ earlier I think that ░░░░░░░░ operated under what we ░░░░░░░░ at the time which ░░░░░░░░ fortunately or unfortunately in ░░░░░░░░ cases was changing rapidly ░░░░░░░░ initially they didn t ░░░░░░░░ know how Covid was ░░░░░░░░ then we had you ░░░░░░░░ the social distancing Then ░░░░░░░░ had businesses that shut ░░░░░░░░ many businesses that did ░░░░░░░░ recover People understand that ░░░░░░░░ just feel like maybe ░░░░░░░░ or progressives or the ░░░░░░░░ health community hasn t ░░░░░░░░ how much damage that ░░░░░░░░ And in the ways ░░░░░░░░ they were wrong Yeah ░░░░░░░░ think it s interesting ░░░░░░░░ you take a step ░░░░░░░░ to 2020 one of ░░░░░░░░ main reasons why Donald ░░░░░░░░ got beat was because ░░░░░░░░ his reaction to Covid ░░░░░░░░ I mean you think ░░░░░░░░ this he let doctor ░░░░░░░░ in the Oval Office ░░░░░░░░ minute of every day ░░░░░░░░ state Georgia governor kemp ░░░░░░░░ myself and the legislature ░░░░░░░░ back up much quicker ░░░░░░░░ got lambasted almost every ░░░░░░░░ of every day by ░░░░░░░░ Trump to see the ░░░░░░░░ he s building around ░░░░░░░░ now is a totally ░░░░░░░░ makeup It s almost ░░░░░░░░ he didn t make ░░░░░░░░ of those mistakes and ░░░░░░░░ was a liability for ░░░░░░░░ So I think that ░░░░░░░░ really some political coaching ░░░░░░░░ build a different team ░░░░░░░░ him but but look ░░░░░░░░ s no doubt about ░░░░░░░░ one of the main ░░░░░░░░ why Donald Trump got ░░░░░░░░ in 2020 was because ░░░░░░░░ his reaction to Covid ░░░░░░░░ he just never seemed ░░░░░░░░ have a good plan ░░░░░░░░ left people confused And ░░░░░░░░ it locked down in ░░░░░░░░ way locked down the ░░░░░░░░ day Someone else can ░░░░░░░░ in here but in ░░░░░░░░ way I feel like ░░░░░░░░ of the reasons why ░░░░░░░░ Biden Harris team suffered ░░░░░░░░ because of all the ░░░░░░░░ they did in response ░░░░░░░░ Covid as well absolutely ░░░░░░░░ key thing about Jay ░░░░░░░░ to understand is obviously ░░░░░░░░ supported the kind of ░░░░░░░░ model the no lockdown ░░░░░░░░ which agree with it ░░░░░░░░ not It worked out ░░░░░░░░ in sweden you know ░░░░░░░░ it wasn t a ░░░░░░░░ It was another choice ░░░░░░░░ what happened to him ░░░░░░░░ he shared his perspective ░░░░░░░░ Twitter We know from ░░░░░░░░ Twitter files it was ░░░░░░░░ that he was put ░░░░░░░░ the blacklist right for ░░░░░░░░ Quote unquote misinformation when ░░░░░░░░ it was just a ░░░░░░░░ viewpoint But sweden is ░░░░░░░░ a much healthier country ░░░░░░░░ we talk about the ░░░░░░░░ that there were so ░░░░░░░░ preexisting conditions from diabetes ░░░░░░░░ affects a lot of ░░░░░░░░ here When you talk ░░░░░░░░ people being overweight when ░░░░░░░░ talk about blood pressure ░░░░░░░░ autoimmune disorders there is ░░░░░░░░ much more here When ░░░░░░░░ look into those factors ░░░░░░░░ of people who would ░░░░░░░░ been at higher risk ░░░░░░░░ Covid that just do ░░░░░░░░ exist in the same ░░░░░░░░ or population in sweden ░░░░░░░░ more important point for ░░░░░░░░ Bhattacharya is that he ░░░░░░░░ censored from Twitter for ░░░░░░░░ a pretty scientifically backed ░░░░░░░░ that was a totally ░░░░░░░░ perspective and people at ░░░░░░░░ time were complaining about ░░░░░░░░ know excess censorship and ░░░░░░░░ of Twitter And they ░░░░░░░░ completely right and and ░░░░░░░░ wisdom what it really ░░░░░░░░ to show is when ░░░░░░░░ when you try to ░░░░░░░░ something it ends up ░░░░░░░░ times as strong And ░░░░░░░░ is the proof of ░░░░░░░░ right That s the ░░░░░░░░ hangover that s helped ░░░░░░░░ Donald Trump back into ░░░░░░░░ I mean I say ░░░░░░░░ all the time One ░░░░░░░░ Donald Trump s he ░░░░░░░░ been talking about it ░░░░░░░░ 8 or 9 years ░░░░░░░░ Washington is working against ░░░░░░░░ Covid created an even ░░░░░░░░ distrust We saw our ░░░░░░░░ agencies fail us We ░░░░░░░░ censorship come on One ░░░░░░░░ the things that we ░░░░░░░░ about men who turn ░░░░░░░░ Donald Trump because they ░░░░░░░░ tired of being told ░░░░░░░░ to do well that ░░░░░░░░ stems from Covid where ░░░░░░░░ were told well you ░░░░░░░░ to get a vaccine ░░░░░░░░ go into a restaurant ░░░░░░░░ You had to This ░░░░░░░░ how you had to ░░░░░░░░ This is how you ░░░░░░░░ to act during this ░░░░░░░░ The hangover is real ░░░░░░░░ distrust in our government ░░░░░░░░ real and that s ░░░░░░░░ of what has propelled ░░░░░░░░ back into office We ░░░░░░░░ saw gun toting Americans ░░░░░░░░ state capitals because they ░░░░░░░░ upset about lockdowns which ░░░░░░░░ something that is completely ░░░░░░░░ Doctor davi I want ░░░░░░░░ talk to you about ░░░░░░░░ as well because it ░░░░░░░░ like this is something ░░░░░░░░ has rocked the public ░░░░░░░░ profession in such a ░░░░░░░░ way like the struggle ░░░░░░░░ to rebuild trust feels ░░░░░░░░ pretty profound Exactly I ░░░░░░░░ medicine and science in ░░░░░░░░ is fueled by peer ░░░░░░░░ research and a lot ░░░░░░░░ discussion You know if ░░░░░░░░ re trying to publish ░░░░░░░░ you take your work ░░░░░░░░ send it to your ░░░░░░░░ so that they can ░░░░░░░░ you exactly I mean ░░░░░░░░ but so they can ░░░░░░░░ you everything that s ░░░░░░░░ with it And then ░░░░░░░░ try to address it ░░░░░░░░ Covid was handled a ░░░░░░░░ different way So that ░░░░░░░░ like the broad sweeping ░░░░░░░░ of view But I ░░░░░░░░ specifically in terms of ░░░░░░░░ we are going to ░░░░░░░░ the consequences of it ░░░░░░░░ we re already seeing ░░░░░░░░ because it s not ░░░░░░░░ the lockdowns where in ░░░░░░░░ past there are people ░░░░░░░░ didn t get their ░░░░░░░░ and their treatment for ░░░░░░░░ problems People are getting ░░░░░░░░ with cancer at later ░░░░░░░░ where something that could ░░░░░░░░ been treatable is no ░░░░░░░░ treatable perhaps Right So ░░░░░░░░ people who are at ░░░░░░░░ for Covid are generally ░░░░░░░░ people who are older ░░░░░░░░ are more vulnerable immunocompromised ░░░░░░░░ those are also the ░░░░░░░░ people who are at ░░░░░░░░ from the lockdowns because ░░░░░░░░ people have been upset ░░░░░░░░ RFK Jr Having a ░░░░░░░░ obviously in the health ░░░░░░░░ I m sorry in ░░░░░░░░ cabinet but do you ░░░░░░░░ bhattacharya in a way ░░░░░░░░ an interesting choice Is ░░░░░░░░ corrective to some things ░░░░░░░░ people now admit were ░░░░░░░░ problem Well I think ░░░░░░░░ has the skills You ░░░░░░░░ even before Covid he ░░░░░░░░ publishing tons of research ░░░░░░░░ how to improve HIV ░░░░░░░░ know identification and slow ░░░░░░░░ spread he looked at ░░░░░░░░ back pain He was ░░░░░░░░ about Medicare so he ░░░░░░░░ had a lot of ░░░░░░░░ skills and was accepted ░░░░░░░░ the medical community Not ░░░░░░░░ that s the primary ░░░░░░░░ but he was you ░░░░░░░░ and so then when ░░░░░░░░ took this minority point ░░░░░░░░ view I guess it ░░░░░░░░ shows like here s ░░░░░░░░ person who s capable ░░░░░░░░ s motivated kind of ░░░░░░░░ these risks But then ░░░░░░░░ somewhat brave you know ░░░░░░░░ you know he took ░░░░░░░░ all this criticism you ░░░░░░░░ at a very challenging ░░░░░░░░ And so I think ░░░░░░░░ are the skills you ░░░░░░░░ to be able to ░░░░░░░░ anything done And really ░░░░░░░░ and be transparent about ░░░░░░░░ s going on Because ░░░░░░░░ wasn t afraid to ░░░░░░░░ transparent before doctor debbie ░░░░░░░░ so much I appreciate ░░░░░░░░ everyone else hang tight ░░░░░░░░ re going to talk ░░░░░░░░ about my favorite thing ░░░░░░░░ because as right wing ░░░░░░░░ and networks get louder ░░░░░░░░ are wondering where they ░░░░░░░░ now and who their ░░░░░░░░ called Joe Rogan s ░░░░░░░░ be Plus what a ░░░░░░░░ like George Carlin survived ░░░░░░░░ scrutiny these days We ░░░░░░░░ discuss CNN Thanksgiving in ░░░░░░░░ live tomorrow at 8 ░░░░░░░░ on CNN Kevin kevin ░░░░░░░░ oh nice Kevin where ░░░░░░░░ you Kevin Hey What ░░░░░░░░ going on I m ░░░░░░░░ here I was busy ░░░░░░░░ backing for the holidays ░░░░░░░░ chase freedom unlimited I ░░░░░░░░ gonna cash back on ░░░░░░░░ gingerbread house Ooh it ░░░░░░░░ got little people inside ░░░░░░░░ a snow globe Oh ░░░░░░░░ wish I lived in ░░░░░░░░ You know I can ░░░░░░░░ believe you lost another ░░░░░░░░ It s a holiday ░░░░░░░░ that it is Earn ░░░░░░░░ time with chase freedom ░░░░░░░░ How do you cash ░░░░░░░░ Chase Make more of ░░░░░░░░ s yours Jen loved ░░░░░░░░ gain hibiscus hula flings ░░░░░░░░ Brad moved in and ░░░░░░░░ along a few new ░░░░░░░░ additions And they discover ░░░░░░░░ when they mix their ░░░░░░░░ they were more than ░░░░░░░░ soulmates they were scent ░░░░░░░░ mix Match more happy ░░░░░░░░ gain Let s just ░░░░░░░░ a little bit know ░░░░░░░░ part is never easy ░░░░░░░░ at least saving on ░░░░░░░░ family s medication is ░░░░░░░░ savings made easy Another ░░░░░░░░ reason to check good ░░░░░░░░ Just a little bit ░░░░░░░░ and you ll feel ░░░░░░░░ better Advil liquid gels ░░░░░░░░ faster and stronger than ░░░░░░░░ rapid release gels also ░░░░░░░░ advil advil targeted relief ░░░░░░░░ only topical with four ░░░░░░░░ pain fighting ingredients that ░░░░░░░░ working on contact and ░░░░░░░░ up to eight hours ░░░░░░░░ do NFL players choose ░░░░░░░░ sleep number Smart bed ░░░░░░░░ like to sleep cool ░░░░░░░░ I like to sleep ░░░░░░░░ cooler and I really ░░░░░░░░ it when we both ░░░░░░░░ what we want Introducing ░░░░░░░░ new sleep number climacool ░░░░░░░░ bed Sleep up to ░░░░░░░░ degrees cooler on each ░░░░░░░░ visit a sleep number ░░░░░░░░ near you When I ░░░░░░░░ diagnosed with HIV I ░░░░░░░░ t know who I ░░░░░░░░ be but here I ░░░░░░░░ being me keep being ░░░░░░░░ and ask your health ░░░░░░░░ provider about the number ░░░░░░░░ prescribed HIV treatment biktarvy ░░░░░░░░ is a complete one ░░░░░░░░ once a day treatment ░░░░░░░░ for HIV in many ░░░░░░░░ Whether you re 18 ░░░░░░░░ 80 with one small ░░░░░░░░ biktarvy fights HIV to ░░░░░░░░ you get to undetectable ░░░░░░░░ stay there Whether you ░░░░░░░░ just starting or replacing ░░░░░░░░ current treatment Research shows ░░░░░░░░ taking HIV treatment as ░░░░░░░░ and getting to and ░░░░░░░░ undetectable prevents transmitting HIV ░░░░░░░░ sex serious side effects ░░░░░░░░ occur including kidney problems ░░░░░░░░ kidney failure rare life ░░░░░░░░ side effects include a ░░░░░░░░ up of lactic acid ░░░░░░░░ liver problems don t ░░░░░░░░ biktarvy if you take ░░░░░░░░ or rifampin Tell your ░░░░░░░░ care provider about all ░░░░░░░░ medicines and supplements you ░░░░░░░░ If you are pregnant ░░░░░░░░ breastfeeding or have kidney ░░░░░░░░ liver problems If you ░░░░░░░░ hepatitis b don t ░░░░░░░░ taking biktarvy without talking ░░░░░░░░ your health care provider ░░░░░░░░ side effects were diarrhea ░░░░░░░░ and headache No matter ░░░░░░░░ life takes you biktarvy ░░░░░░░░ go with you Talk ░░░░░░░░ your health care provider ░░░░░░░░ Jack the Turkey with ░░░░░░░░ and fixings Fa la ░░░░░░░░ la la la la ░░░░░░░░ la Dad we are ░░░░░░░░ a restaurant.