CNBC’s Kernen, Elizabeth Warren Clash Over Price Gouging: You Never Lose an Argument Because ‘No One Can Ever Say Anything Back to You’

KERNEN Look at The ░░░░░░░░ Post And if you ░░░░░░░░ The Washington Post as ░░░░░░░░ Democrat you ve got ░░░░░░░░ serious problems This is ░░░░░░░░ they said about the ░░░░░░░░ gouging or the price ░░░░░░░░ legislation It was really ░░░░░░░░ from both sides of ░░░░░░░░ aisle even Jason Furman ░░░░░░░░ don t know if ░░░░░░░░ saw some of his ░░░░░░░░ He said it s ░░░░░░░░ good policy and it ░░░░░░░░ actually do more harm ░░░░░░░░ good I can paint ░░░░░░░░ a picture of how ░░░░░░░░ would work and how ░░░░░░░░ s worked in the ░░░░░░░░ where we ve tried ░░░░░░░░ artificially hold prices down ░░░░░░░░ doesn t come in ░░░░░░░░ don t like if ░░░░░░░░ is too high people ░░░░░░░░ t move to chicken ░░░░░░░░ don t come in ░░░░░░░░ undercut where the beef ░░░░░░░░ are Nothing works when ░░░░░░░░ try to artificially control ░░░░░░░░ It s just the ░░░░░░░░ and demand issue It ░░░░░░░░ a flawed idea Warren ░░░░░░░░ so did you have ░░░░░░░░ question here KERNEN Yes ░░░░░░░░ would you propose a ░░░░░░░░ idea when the real ░░░░░░░░ Warren So let me ░░░░░░░░ you a question KERNEN ░░░░░░░░ you really want to ░░░░░░░░ the middle class if ░░░░░░░░ really sincerely want to ░░░░░░░░ people having trouble at ░░░░░░░░ grocery store it s ░░░░░░░░ price gouging that s ░░░░░░░░ issue And if you ░░░░░░░░ at it seriously and ░░░░░░░░ want to help them ░░░░░░░░ let s do something ░░░░░░░░ it together Fine Warren ░░░░░░░░ understand if you want ░░░░░░░░ do a lecture about ░░░░░░░░ but let s just ░░░░░░░░ with where have you ░░░░░░░░ for the last 30 ░░░░░░░░ as three dozen states ░░░░░░░░ price gouging laws and ░░░░░░░░ have used them effectively ░░░░░░░░ like Texas and Florida ░░░░░░░░ ve used price gouging ░░░░░░░░ Price gouging laws are ░░░░░░░░ price control Price gouging ░░░░░░░░ are to say you ░░░░░░░░ sometimes markets go off ░░░░░░░░ rails And when they ░░░░░░░░ we need some ways ░░░░░░░░ get them back on ░░░░░░░░ rails We need some ░░░░░░░░ on that behavior So ░░░░░░░░ example we watched in ░░░░░░░░ pandemic how prices went ░░░░░░░░ for a whole lot ░░░░░░░░ reasons They went up ░░░░░░░░ because we had supply ░░░░░░░░ kinks we had problems ░░░░░░░░ of the war in ░░░░░░░░ that cut supplies of ░░░░░░░░ commodities and one of ░░░░░░░░ things that happened as ░░░░░░░░ result of that is ░░░░░░░░ were corporations that said ░░░░░░░░ Now that we have ░░░░░░░░ now that prices are ░░░░░░░░ overall this is a ░░░░░░░░ opportunity for us to ░░░░░░░░ prices not just in ░░░░░░░░ along costs but to ░░░░░░░░ way way way above ░░░░░░░░ And how do we ░░░░░░░░ that it was way ░░░░░░░░ above just passing along ░░░░░░░░ Look at what happened ░░░░░░░░ their profit margins If ░░░░░░░░ had just been passing ░░░░░░░░ costs profit margins would ░░░░░░░░ stayed about the same ░░░░░░░░ for some industries some ░░░░░░░░ profit margins shot up ░░░░░░░░ do you know where ░░░░░░░░ shot up most often ░░░░░░░░ was in companies or ░░░░░░░░ industries where there was ░░░░░░░░ lot of concentration a ░░░░░░░░ of market power places ░░░░░░░░ the market is not ░░░░░░░░ competitively So you end ░░░░░░░░ with some and you ░░░░░░░░ we all talked about ░░░░░░░░ prices You end up ░░░░░░░░ something like this giant ░░░░░░░░ producer Cal Maine and ░░░░░░░░ Maine raises the price ░░░░░░░░ eggs Their profit margins ░░░░░░░░ by 718 That s ░░░░░░░░ just passing along costs ░░░░░░░░ that is a time ░░░░░░░░ That s sophistry Your ░░░░░░░░ on Kraft your example ░░░░░░░░ Kraft is either Warren ░░░░░░░░ finished first In any ░░░░░░░░ the states around the ░░░░░░░░ that already have price ░░░░░░░░ laws KERNEN Can I ░░░░░░░░ you why those are ░░░░░░░░ and misleading at best ░░░░░░░░ you Kraft analogy please ░░░░░░░░ me tell you Kraft ░░░░░░░░ say was 440 profit ░░░░░░░░ The example you used ░░░░░░░░ prior quarter from the ░░░░░░░░ before they had a ░░░░░░░░ of 1 3 billion ░░░░░░░░ accounting change which wiped ░░░░░░░░ profits Then they earned ░░░░░░░░ they normally let me ░░░░░░░░ now They earned Warren ░░░░░░░░ didn t let me ░░░░░░░░ Look at the data ░░░░░░░░ on We have economic ░░░░░░░░ now after economic study ░░░░░░░░ This is the way ░░░░░░░░ always goes Warren When ░░░░░░░░ is more concentration KERNEN ░░░░░░░░ 40 million eggs were ░░░░░░░░ because of avian flu ░░░░░░░░ When there is more ░░░░░░░░ in an industry we ░░░░░░░░ seen much greater increases ░░░░░░░░ the profit margins KERNEN ░░░░░░░░ you attribute the inflation ░░░░░░░░ s what you think ░░░░░░░░ need to do to ░░░░░░░░ it Warren And they ░░░░░░░░ not random They re ░░░░░░░░ random one offs it ░░░░░░░░ part of the problem ░░░░░░░░ you ve got companies ░░░░░░░░ are gouging consumers on ░░░░░░░░ consumers need to know ░░░░░░░░ ve got somebody on ░░░░░░░░ side KERNEN Senator senator ░░░░░░░░ re trying to help ░░░░░░░░ re trying to actually ░░░░░░░░ Warren Where are you ░░░░░░░░ the 36 37 states ░░░░░░░░ currently have price gouging ░░░░░░░░ EVANS Just quickly on ░░░░░░░░ point senator this is ░░░░░░░░ can I just clarify ░░░░░░░░ how this would work ░░░░░░░░ We re never gonna ░░░░░░░░ able to this is ░░░░░░░░ way you never lose ░░░░░░░░ argument because no one ░░░░░░░░ ever say anything back ░░░░░░░░ you senator It s ░░░░░░░░