David Petraeus: Prigozhin ‘Should Be Very Careful Around Open Windows’

BASH Here with me ░░░░░░░░ to talk about that ░░░░░░░░ much more is retired ░░░░░░░░ S Army general and ░░░░░░░░ CIA director David Petraeus ░░░░░░░░ you for joining me ░░░░░░░░ I want to talk ░░░░░░░░ the impact on Ukraine ░░░░░░░░ a moment but let ░░░░░░░░ just start with what ░░░░░░░░ happening inside Russia a ░░░░░░░░ 24 hours What do ░░░░░░░░ make of what happened ░░░░░░░░ what do you believe ░░░░░░░░ means for Putin s ░░░░░░░░ inside Russia PETRAEUS Well ░░░░░░░░ think clearly Putin is ░░░░░░░░ His government is weakened ░░░░░░░░ irony is that his ░░░░░░░░ partner in Belarus Lukashenko ░░░░░░░░ to bail him out ░░░░░░░░ this Prigozhin kept his ░░░░░░░░ but lost his Wagner ░░░░░░░░ And he should be ░░░░░░░░ careful around open windows ░░░░░░░░ his new surroundings in ░░░░░░░░ where he s going ░░░░░░░░ Prigozhin lost his nerve ░░░░░░░░ was as you noted ░░░░░░░░ within roughly two hours ░░░░░░░░ of the outskirts of ░░░░░░░░ where they were starting ░░░░░░░░ prepare defensive positions This ░░░░░░░░ although it had some ░░░░░░░░ along the way didn ░░░░░░░░ appear to be generating ░░░░░░░░ kind of support that ░░░░░░░░ had hoped it would ░░░░░░░░ again he decided to ░░░░░░░░ the deal He gave ░░░░░░░░ this effort So a ░░░░░░░░ series of developments In ░░░░░░░░ meantime Putin fled Moscow ░░░░░░░░ didn t stay around ░░░░░░░░ we haven t seen ░░░░░░░░ of Putin s minister ░░░░░░░░ defense or chief of ░░░░░░░░ general staff Shoigu and ░░░░░░░░ So again clearly I ░░░░░░░░ the government has been ░░░░░░░░ Putin has been shaken ░░░░░░░░ This makes him more ░░░░░░░░ arguably than he has ░░░░░░░░ any time in his ░░░░░░░░ decade rule of the ░░░░░░░░ Federation Who knows where ░░░░░░░░ could go now We ░░░░░░░░ always asked who would ░░░░░░░░ the one who would ░░░░░░░░ a blow at the ░░░░░░░░ And now we know ░░░░░░░░ he failed And it ░░░░░░░░ to mind also Napoleon ░░░░░░░░ admonition If you start ░░░░░░░░ take Vienna take Vienna ░░░░░░░░ lost his nerve turned ░░░░░░░░ And also the future ░░░░░░░░ the Wagner Group not ░░░░░░░░ clear how many of ░░░░░░░░ will sign a contract ░░░░░░░░ the ministry of defense ░░░░░░░░ was the real bone ░░░░░░░░ contention to begin with ░░░░░░░░ Prigozhin would lose control ░░░░░░░░ this mercenary force he ░░░░░░░░ built over a number ░░░░░░░░ years BASH I want ░░░░░░░░ ask about Putin because ░░░░░░░░ have studied him and ░░░░░░░░ understand what makes him ░░░░░░░░ so to speak He ░░░░░░░░ portrays himself as the ░░░░░░░░ in Russia This conflict ░░░░░░░░ to have pulled the ░░░░░░░░ back to maybe see ░░░░░░░░ a bit different Explain ░░░░░░░░ it means for him ░░░░░░░░ Putin the man who ░░░░░░░░ so much bravado to ░░░░░░░░ metaphorically kicked in the ░░░░░░░░ PETRAEUS Well it creates ░░░░░░░░ lot of doubts I ░░░░░░░░ sure in the minds ░░░░░░░░ those around him I ░░░░░░░░ sure they already had ░░░░░░░░ This whole invasion the ░░░░░░░░ invasion has been a ░░░░░░░░ mistake a terrible blunder ░░░░░░░░ the part of Putin ░░░░░░░░ losses are staggering many ░░░░░░░░ times already just in ░░░░░░░░ first 16 months what ░░░░░░░░ Russians lost in nearly ░░░░░░░░ decade in Afghanistan a ░░░░░░░░ that ultimately was unsustainable ░░░░░░░░ of course what we ░░░░░░░░ to do is to ░░░░░░░░ to provide everything possible ░░░░░░░░ Ukraine to enable them ░░░░░░░░ this summer offensive which ░░░░░░░░ still in the earlier ░░░░░░░░ early days as the ░░░░░░░░ of state noted to ░░░░░░░░ and over time to ░░░░░░░░ Putin that he s ░░░░░░░░ going to be able ░░░░░░░░ out suffer the Ukrainians ░░░░░░░░ Europeans and the Americans ░░░░░░░░ way Russians out suffered ░░░░░░░░ s army and the ░░░░░░░░ BASH How unstable is ░░░░░░░░ right now How worried ░░░░░░░░ the rest of the ░░░░░░░░ be about that PETRAEUS ░░░░░░░░ it should we should ░░░░░░░░ concerned about this I ░░░░░░░░ t think we want ░░░░░░░░ country that spans 11 ░░░░░░░░ zones and includes republics ░░░░░░░░ the Russian Federation of ░░░░░░░░ different ethnic and sectarian ░░░░░░░░ to come apart at ░░░░░░░░ seams So we have ░░░░░░░░ what happens when there ░░░░░░░░ regime change in countries ░░░░░░░░ the last 20 years ░░░░░░░░ outcome is not always ░░░░░░░░ for the world And ░░░░░░░░ s just unclear where ░░░░░░░░ will go Is this ░░░░░░░░ beginning of the end ░░░░░░░░ Putin We don t ░░░░░░░░ Whoever follows him if ░░░░░░░░ is the case will ░░░░░░░░ be even more dictatorial ░░░░░░░░ is what we feared ░░░░░░░░ be the case if ░░░░░░░░ may have been successful ░░░░░░░░ there actually be a ░░░░░░░░ leader who steps in ░░░░░░░░ realizes what a catastrophic ░░░░░░░░ this whole Ukraine endeavor ░░░░░░░░ been and realize that ░░░░░░░░ need to somehow get ░░░░░░░░ more rational approach to ░░░░░░░░ and to the West ░░░░░░░░ many unknowns again as ░░░░░░░░ Blinken highlighted BASH Many ░░░░░░░░ I want our viewers ░░░░░░░░ look at a map ░░░░░░░░ the latest positions in ░░░░░░░░ Just this morning Ukraine ░░░░░░░░ claiming it took a ░░░░░░░░ line of trenches back ░░░░░░░░ in Russia from Russia ░░░░░░░░ Bakhmut I know you ░░░░░░░░ just in Ukraine last ░░░░░░░░ What should Ukraine do ░░░░░░░░ now to take advantage ░░░░░░░░ of the chaos inside ░░░░░░░░ PETRAEUS Well I don ░░░░░░░░ think sadly that the ░░░░░░░░ inside Russia and even ░░░░░░░░ Prigozhin surrounding the headquarters ░░░░░░░░ oversees the so called ░░░░░░░░ Military District headquarters that ░░░░░░░░ overseeing the operations on ░░░░░░░░ ground in Ukraine unfortunately ░░░░░░░░ not had a significant ░░░░░░░░ on the front lines ░░░░░░░░ does not appear So ░░░░░░░░ Ukraine has to do ░░░░░░░░ is to continue these ░░░░░░░░ attacks this reconnaissance in ░░░░░░░░ trying to find seams ░░░░░░░░ to find areas that ░░░░░░░░ can break through then ░░░░░░░░ commit their main forces ░░░░░░░░ still have seen only ░░░░░░░░ very small number of ░░░░░░░░ new nine or so ░░░░░░░░ equipped armored brigades And ░░░░░░░░ of course when they ░░░░░░░░ that to achieve combined ░░░░░░░░ effects of tanks with ░░░░░░░░ with air defense with ░░░░░░░░ with artillery mortars electronic ░░░░░░░░ drones out over the ░░░░░░░░ good command and control ░░░░░░░░ right up behind them ░░░░░░░░ follow on forces ready ░░░░░░░░ exploit the opportunities that ░░░░░░░░ created by the lead ░░░░░░░░ I think that will ░░░░░░░░ but no one can ░░░░░░░░ when they might find ░░░░░░░░ opportunity Could it be ░░░░░░░░ Bakhmut from which of ░░░░░░░░ the Prigozhin Wagner Group ░░░░░░░░ withdrawn after its success ░░░░░░░░ only success in the ░░░░░░░░ offensive that cost them ░░░░░░░░ 20 000 lives a ░░░░░░░░ loss Will that be ░░░░░░░░ location or will it ░░░░░░░░ a little bit further ░░░░░░░░ down around the Zaporizhzhia ░░░░░░░░ perhaps the border with ░░░░░░░░ Again that s what ░░░░░░░░ re trying to find ░░░░░░░░ right now And they ░░░░░░░░ they we discussed this ░░░░░░░░ I was in Ukraine ░░░░░░░░ have very clear eyes ░░░░░░░░ assessments about the strength ░░░░░░░░ these defensive positions the ░░░░░░░░ lines of minefields obstacles ░░░░░░░░ and so forth And ░░░░░░░░ through those is very ░░░░░░░░ challenging in that very ░░░░░░░░ terrain that characterizes the ░░░░░░░░ in that part of ░░░░░░░░ BASH General David Petraeus ░░░░░░░░ grateful for your time ░░░░░░░░ morning for your expertise ░░░░░░░░ it PETRAEUS Good to ░░░░░░░░ with you Dana Thank ░░░░░░░░