Nina Jankowicz Says Ministry of Truth ‘Was a Victim of Disinformation’: Our National Security Is in Danger Now

ANCHOR Nina Jankowicz the ░░░░░░░░ of the Disinformation Governance ░░░░░░░░ at the Department of ░░░░░░░░ Security has resigned This ░░░░░░░░ after Homeland Security Secretary ░░░░░░░░ Mayorkas paused the program ░░░░░░░░ three weeks after it ░░░░░░░░ announced amid criticism from ░░░░░░░░ The board was established ░░░░░░░░ April to standardize the ░░░░░░░░ of disinformation across various ░░░░░░░░ in DHS Nina Jankowicz ░░░░░░░░ us now Thank you ░░░░░░░░ much She s the ░░░░░░░░ executive director of the ░░░░░░░░ Governance Board She also ░░░░░░░░ the author of How ░░░░░░░░ Lose the Information War ░░░░░░░░ How To Be a ░░░░░░░░ Online So Nina do ░░░░░░░░ think the Disinformation Board ░░░░░░░░ the victim of in ░░░░░░░░ misinformation given the backlash ░░░░░░░░ saw JANKOWICZ Really Jamie ░░░░░░░░ I would say that ░░░░░░░░ Disinformation Governance Board was ░░░░░░░░ victim of disinformation So ░░░░░░░░ difference between dis and ░░░░░░░░ is disinformation is false ░░░░░░░░ spread with malign intent ░░░░░░░░ clearly there was a ░░░░░░░░ intent on some actors ░░░░░░░░ the media and in ░░░░░░░░ who just really stood ░░░░░░░░ to the the formation ░░░░░░░░ this board because it ░░░░░░░░ be confronting disinformation They ░░░░░░░░ mischaracterized its mission And ░░░░░░░░ this childish behavior is ░░░░░░░░ our national security now ░░░░░░░░ board was set up ░░░░░░░░ counter real disinformation that ░░░░░░░░ Americans less safe things ░░░░░░░░ false information related to ░░░░░░░░ border security our elections ░░░░░░░░ other critical infrastructure like ░░░░░░░░ and banks So those ░░░░░░░░ stand in opposition to ░░░░░░░░ board which as the ░░░░░░░░ said was just an ░░░░░░░░ coordinating mechanism something to ░░░░░░░░ sure that we were ░░░░░░░░ and using best practices ░░░░░░░░ standing in the way ░░░░░░░░ our national security ANCHOR ░░░░░░░░ is this is this ░░░░░░░░ a tough one here ░░░░░░░░ I have to tell ░░░░░░░░ the things that I ░░░░░░░░ reading about what was ░░░░░░░░ to you online and ░░░░░░░░ your family had to ░░░░░░░░ with death threats in ░░░░░░░░ you re an expert ░░░░░░░░ disinformation online and in ░░░░░░░░ women who experience online ░░░░░░░░ and harassment Can you ░░░░░░░░ for people just what ░░░░░░░░ life has been like ░░░░░░░░ you know just what ░░░░░░░░ family was under JANKOWICZ ░░░░░░░░ Jamie ph I m ░░░░░░░░ ve dealt with harassment ░░░░░░░░ but nothing like this ░░░░░░░░ was three weeks of ░░░░░░░░ an onslaught there were ░░░░░░░░ one or two days ░░░░░░░░ the past three weeks ░░░░░░░░ I didn t have ░░░░░░░░ report a violent threat ░░░░░░░░ the security services at ░░░░░░░░ And your viewers can ░░░░░░░░ see but I m ░░░░░░░░ weeks pregnant Not that ░░░░░░░░ saves me from criticism ░░░░░░░░ certainly I believe that ░░░░░░░░ should be able to ░░░░░░░░ a serious conversation in ░░░░░░░░ United States about real ░░░░░░░░ that you know I ░░░░░░░░ why Americans are upset ░░░░░░░░ the idea of of ░░░░░░░░ board that might decide ░░░░░░░░ s true or false ░░░░░░░░ course that s not ░░░░░░░░ the board was going ░░░░░░░░ be doing but I ░░░░░░░░ t deserve death threats ░░░░░░░░ my public service to ░░░░░░░░ country And so I ░░░░░░░░ that we can walk ░░░░░░░░ discourse back and recognize ░░░░░░░░ this vitriol this partisanship ░░░░░░░░ us more vulnerable to ░░░░░░░░ threats the very threats ░░░░░░░░ the disinformation governance board ░░░░░░░░ set up to address ░░░░░░░░ Well that s it ░░░░░░░░ t matter where you ░░░░░░░░ in the political spectrum ░░░░░░░░ And we ve become ░░░░░░░░ far apart And I ░░░░░░░░ that people you know ░░░░░░░░ to argue with each ░░░░░░░░ and they want to ░░░░░░░░ the world in black ░░░░░░░░ white but to get ░░░░░░░░ threats is just it ░░░░░░░░ just unacceptable I mean ░░░░░░░░ I just find it ░░░░░░░░ unacceptable So I m ░░░░░░░░ you had to go ░░░░░░░░ that I don t ░░░░░░░░ anybody on either side ░░░░░░░░ the aisle should have ░░░░░░░░ go through that And ░░░░░░░░ have to imagine that ░░░░░░░░ is one of the ░░░░░░░░ you stepped down from ░░░░░░░░ board can you explain ░░░░░░░░ some of the other ░░░░░░░░ of stepping down JANKOWICZ ░░░░░░░░ I m happy to ░░░░░░░░ one for the country ░░░░░░░░ it comes to protecting ░░░░░░░░ national security and putting ░░░░░░░░ issues at the forefront ░░░░░░░░ I do believe they ░░░░░░░░ some of the most ░░░░░░░░ issues of our time ░░░░░░░░ was less about the ░░░░░░░░ and more about the ░░░░░░░░ s response to this ░░░░░░░░ campaign and and the ░░░░░░░░ against me that caused ░░░░░░░░ to step down The ░░░░░░░░ is now its future ░░░░░░░░ now uncertain And again ░░░░░░░░ believe these are really ░░░░░░░░ important threats that deserve ░░░░░░░░ be looked at very ░░░░░░░░ and I believe I ░░░░░░░░ do that outside of ░░░░░░░░ I m not going ░░░░░░░░ be silenced by my ░░░░░░░░ And I hope that ░░░░░░░░ department will go forward ░░░░░░░░ this important work because ░░░░░░░░ is critical As I ░░░░░░░░ it has to do ░░░░░░░░ the safety and security ░░░░░░░░ all Americans Things like ░░░░░░░░ sure that people have ░░░░░░░░ to disaster aid making ░░░░░░░░ that they have good ░░░░░░░░ about when and how ░░░░░░░░ cast their vote in ░░░░░░░░ elections This is the ░░░░░░░░ that the Department of ░░░░░░░░ Security is charged with ░░░░░░░░ not any of the ░░░░░░░░ people were characterizing the ░░░░░░░░ as dealing with online ░░░░░░░░ I hope that work ░░░░░░░░ I know I will ░░░░░░░░ continuing it regardless of ░░░░░░░░ threats And I hope ░░░░░░░░ administration responds to these ░░░░░░░░ with conviction in the ░░░░░░░░ ANCHOR You know I ░░░░░░░░ to ask you a ░░░░░░░░ of people in the ░░░░░░░░ Party came after you ░░░░░░░░ some tweets from the ░░░░░░░░ saying that they were ░░░░░░░░ political What do you ░░░░░░░░ to say about that ░░░░░░░░ Well I have to ░░░░░░░░ that there are 250 ░░░░░░░░ employees at the Department ░░░░░░░░ Homeland insecurity I was ░░░░░░░░ of them we all ░░░░░░░░ different political inclinations and ░░░░░░░░ all checked them at ░░░░░░░░ door As a political ░░░░░░░░ I was also subject ░░░░░░░░ the Hatch Act which ░░░░░░░░ my political activity and ░░░░░░░░ s something I took ░░░░░░░░ seriously You know as ░░░░░░░░ as a private citizen ░░░░░░░░ express my opinions with ░░░░░░░░ First Amendment rights and ░░░░░░░░ for those First Amendment ░░░░░░░░ making sure that the ░░░░░░░░ of Homeland Security was ░░░░░░░░ its work in addressing ░░░░░░░░ with respect to the ░░░░░░░░ Amendment with privacy rights ░░░░░░░░ rights and civil liberties ░░░░░░░░ was one of the ░░░░░░░░ that I went there ░░░░░░░░ went there to protect ░░░░░░░░ rights and serve the ░░░░░░░░ of all Americans regardless ░░░░░░░░ political inclination And since ░░░░░░░░ wasn t adjudicating on ░░░░░░░░ was true or false ░░░░░░░░ just trying to equip ░░░░░░░░ with information they could ░░░░░░░░ in issues of national ░░░░░░░░ you know I don ░░░░░░░░ think that my political ░░░░░░░░ really come into play ░░░░░░░░ And as I said ░░░░░░░░ checked them at the ░░░░░░░░ I was fighting for ░░░░░░░░ First Amendment rights And ░░░░░░░░ think it s quite ░░░░░░░░ that Republicans would decontextualized ░░░░░░░░ couple of tweets in ░░░░░░░░ career that has been ░░░░░░░░ by reasonableness nuance and ░░░░░░░░ I have been an ░░░░░░░░ for policies coming from ░░░░░░░░ like Senator Rob Portman ░░░░░░░░ put together a great ░░░░░░░░ bill last summer in ░░░░░░░░ National Defense Authorization Act ░░░░░░░░ I ve been a ░░░░░░░░ and Democratic witness in ░░░░░░░░ So I would point ░░░░░░░░ those those parts of ░░░░░░░░ CV and my resume ░░░░░░░░ not these tweets and ░░░░░░░░ of my personal life ░░░░░░░░ have been picked on ░░░░░░░░ this childish game in ░░░░░░░░ to endanger our national ░░░░░░░░ That s what s ░░░░░░░░ on here ANCHOR Well ░░░░░░░░ did reveal that part ░░░░░░░░ your personal life is ░░░░░░░░ you re going to ░░░░░░░░ a child so congratulations ░░░░░░░░ that We ll focus ░░░░░░░░ JANKOWICZ Thank you ANCHOR ░░░░░░░░ forward Nina Jankowicz thank ░░░░░░░░ so much Appreciate you ░░░░░░░░ with us JANKOWICZ My ░░░░░░░░